Upgrading bulbs in headlight

[JGP]

I'm thinking about exchanging the stock headlamps (low & high beam) and replacing them with PIAA lamps that double the wattage to 110w. PIAA notes that the lighting is significantly improved.

Has anyone tried this? What impact does it have by doing so? Would one have to do both lamps? The bulbs are pricey, nearly $50.00 each.

Thanks up front for the feedback.

jgp

[ScooterCop]

http://www.easternbeaver.com/Main/Produ ... _kits.html

[deilenberger]

I would suspect the ZFE might see the excessive current draw of the 110W PIAA bulbs as a fault and turn the headlight off.

These are H11 bulbs - didn't know PIAA made H11's..

Ah - found it. Some comments on these:

And FWIW - In testing I did for the BMW Car Club of America Roundel Magazine a few years ago, I found light output claims for most "upgrade" bulbs to be bogus.. with the exception of a few Osram and Philips +50 bulbs.

Blue coatings on bulbs absorb light. They filter out longer wavelengths of light, leaving the blue component (white light is ALL colors combined.) The use of blue is really debatable since many people have problems with scattered light and glare when the light color has a blue cast to it. Blue IMHO is marketing - trying to make a halogen bulb look like an HID light source. PIAA is using a blue coating. Osram and Philips did not.

The page on PIAA's website seems to be claiming that the bulbs still draw 55W, but produce "110W" of light. Light is not measured in Watts - that's a measure of current. Light is measured in lumens (luminous flux) or foot-candles. Using "Watts" as a measure of light is totally bogus, and immediately makes me look askance at the manufacturer.

I know many people are fans of PIAA lights and bulbs - but IMHO - this is a case of marketing triumphing over performance. They make some auxiliary lighting that is good - but very pricey compared to products made by reputable manufacturers such as Hella, especially by a performance vs cost = value type analysis.

If you're really interested in trying some higher output bulbs, I'd suggest looking at PowerBulbs.com - http://www.powerbulbs.com/product_list.asp?cat1=39 - the show an Osram bulbs with some impressive claims. Can't say for sure if the claims are true - but in the past - Osram bulbs I have tested met or exceeded the claims made for them.

In either case - PIAA or Osram - there is no free lunch. In order to get more light with the same current draw - the filament must be burned hotter, which shortens lifetime. I have heard complaints on the PIAA bulbs of very short life spans. The Osram specifications on their +50 bulbs reflect this reality - but at least Osram offers a 1 year warranty on the bulbs.

In looking at the price - the Osram bulbs are about $66/pair. The PIAA are $89/pair. I've had excellent luck ordering from PowerBulbs in the past with delivery in less than a week via Air-Post. Shipping is free for Powerbulbs and no taxes are collected. Shipping from the PIAA website is $8.90, bringing the total close to $100 for the pair.

I think you'd be better served by auxiliary lights - they allow for lighting areas the stock lights will never illuminate, and provide redundancy in the event of a bulb failure.

Oh - my background of a former life was basic research into the properties of light at Bell Labs.. long ago in a time when research was being done in the USA.

[JGP]

Thanks for the feedback, most informative. I currently have Motolights installed (yellow lamps) on my R12R, they work fine, came on the bike when I purchased. I was just trying to maximize my nightime vision.

While we are talking about lighting...................Seriously giving thought about a modulator. Any input would be appreciated. I've emailed Kisan (Andy) our last correspondence was they are making a modulator for the R12R to deal with CANBUS. It was supposed to be ready in week to ten days, that was several weeks ago. Follow up to Kisan, failed to get a response..........

[Skippy]

Just put in a hid xenon light they wil last longer give way more light with less power(35w) so is cooler then stock or replacemetn halogen bulbs. I'm going to do it sometime in the winter I think and go for a 6000k xenon light witch costs about 100 euro's with 3 years warrenty. You will probably never neat the highbeam ever again after fitting a hid light so in a way they will be cheaper then 2 piaa bulbs that burn out all the time.

[deilenberger]

Thanks for the feedback, most informative. I currently have Motolights installed (yellow lamps) on my R12R, they work fine, came on the bike when I purchased. I was just trying to maximize my nightime vision.

While we are talking about lighting...................Seriously giving thought about a modulator. Any input would be appreciated. I've emailed Kisan (Andy) our last correspondence was they are making a modulator for the R12R to deal with CANBUS. It was supposed to be ready in week to ten days, that was several weeks ago. Follow up to Kisan, failed to get a response..........

I have a Kisan on my bike.. the one you want may not be the one their website suggests for the R1200R.

If you'd like - there are more details here in another posting I made, and on my website.. http://www.eilenberger.net - specifically: http://www.eilenberger.net/R1200R_Roads ... or_fix.htm

You want: http://www.kisantech.com/view_product.p ... t=P115W-A2 - and you want the Z option (CanBus)

The one their website suggests plugs into the rear of the headlight shell.. which won't work well because the ballast bulb would be outside the shell, and the charcoal canister hits the modulator.

[deilenberger]

http://www.easternbeaver.com/Main/Produ ... _kits.html

Scooter Cop - Jim's stuff is excellent, but two problems with the kits, no - make that three..

• The Roadster R1200R uses H11 bulbs - not H4's like the 1100/1150 bikes.
  
  The CANBUS may not like the relay current draw (too low) - and the bulb monitor may think a bulb is out.. again, not something the 1100/1150 bikes have - but a concern with any 1200.
  
  The headlight shell of the R1200R has limited space inside - and if I had to guess - the relays are not going to fit. The wiring going into the shell goes in via a plug connector, so mounting them externally isn't a good option, and - the CANBUS design overcomes the need for the relays - there isn't the long wire path used on 1100/1150 bikes going to the headlights. The wiring goes directly from the ZFE switching module to the headlight - a short distance away.

Other than that..

[BOXERCOLOMBIA]

Don..
Is there any way to install or replace them with the nice xenon ones ??, i have heard that there is a sort of "conversion kit" around the market for replacing ordinary bulbs with xenon ligths...
any lights to this topic ??

[Skippy]

Why wouldn't there be?! Just look up companies that provide xenon/hid conversion kits look for the correct bulbtype(h11 in the case of the R1200R) look at your bike for a place to put the ballast(on the other side of the steering tube so where the horn isn't) and you should be all set. There are also cables that are longer to make finding a place for the ballast even easier like oplacing under the seat or where ever. Will set you back about 119 euro's for good quality unit and even less for cheaper ones from e-bay or whatever. The Hid/xenon will work fine and there will be no can bus issues or faulty messages on your boardcomputer.

[deilenberger]

While there are kits to convert almost any halogen based headlight to HID/Xenon - the results - while throwing a lot of light out - are mixed. The reason I say that is the glare they can cause oncoming motorists.

If you look at your H11 bulb - there is a silvered end on it. The purpose of the silver end is anti-glare.. the actual light source isn't directly viewable from the front of the light. HID conversions also don't necessarily have the same light source position and shape as the halogen bulb the reflector is designed for - again a potential source of glare for oncoming traffic.

While a lot of people say "so-what.." - the "so-what" is - the oncoming driver can be both blinded by, and attracted to your overly bright point source of light.

I've tried HID conversions on BMW cars - after trying them for a few weeks, I decided the gains weren't worth the downside and took them out. Factory HID lights, with a proper anti-glare shield in front of the HID capsule, and a reflector made for the HID light source are fine.. and if/when BMW comes out with that as a factory option, I'd love to get one.

Meanwhile - I'm pretty happy with the auxiliary lights I have - they aren't something I'd over-drive, and I do switch them off when they might blind on-coming traffic, and more important to me - they make my bike much more conspicuous in daytime.

YMMV.. as usual..

[ErikM]

I put a set of these in.. They are BRIGHTER http://www.powerbulbs.com/product_detail.asp?prod=113 Also afaik they are not yet available in the US

[Dan-A]

The page on PIAA's website seems to be claiming that the bulbs still draw 55W, but produce "110W" of light. Light is not measured in Watts - that's a measure of current. Light is measured in lumens (luminous flux) or foot-candles. Using "Watts" as a measure of light is totally bogus, and immediately makes me look askance at the manufacturer.

Lightbulbs are commonly sold based on wattage as a rating, so not to be argumentative, but...

Ohms=resistance
Amps=current
Watts=power

http://www.the12volt.com/ohm/ohmslaw.asp

Perhaps lumens is an accurate rating of light effectiveness, but wattage is not suspect.

http://www.theledlight.com/lumens.html

[NeilS]

I agree with Don here. While we all think of light bulbs in terms of power (wattage), and we all go to Home Depot and buy "60-watt bulbs," power really doesn't correlate well with the light produced by a bulb.

Here's an example: Thinking about Ohm's Law, the only parameter that a bulb manufacturer can really control is its resistance. To a first approximation, the resistance of a filament is R = k * L / A, where L is the length of the filament, A is its cross-sectional area, and k (for the purposes of this discussion) is a constant. So, to make a filament of a given resistance, a manufacturer can make it long and thick or short and thin. Both bulbs will have the same resistance and will consume the same amount of power when connected to a given voltage source. But the short thin filament will have the power dissipated in a much smaller amount of metal than the long thick filament. It will therefore operate at a higher temperature, make more light, and burn for fewer hours than its long thin counterpart.

Most people don't understand this, so it leads to a lot of bogus marketing claims and mis-information.

HTH

[Rog(UK) - Yorkshire Dales]

I find this a very interesting discussion. Visibility to other motorists is something about which we all care.
As has been said, wattage is only one factor in the equation. I seem to remember reading in some BMW car literature that the xenon lights fitted to their cars required that the reflectors or lenses had to be designed to provide a less highly defined beam, simply so that oncoming vehicles could actually SEE the light. The best way I can illustrate this is by using the case when you are riding along a smooth but wet road in the dark. You simply cannot see the road surface, because the light is not being reflected back to the rider.

If you fit xenon riding lights which have a very highly defined beam, then traffic outside the cone of light cannot see the light no matter how bright it is - and of course this means that vehicles at intersections cannot see those lights, which, to me, makes them almost worthless.

Happy Christmas and ride safely,

Rog

[deilenberger]

Perhaps lumens is an accurate rating of light effectiveness, but wattage is not suspect.

http://www.theledlight.com/lumens.html

Excellent page.. thanks for the link, I'll bookmark it.

As Neil points out - the Wattage (POWER consumed) doesn't actually indicate the light produced. Bulbs are sold by Wattage - but take a look at a 35W incandescent bulb vs a 35W florescent bulb. The 35W florescent bulb puts out the same quanity of light as a 75W incandescent.

The "quantity" of light is what we are looking for - and specifically - the quantity of light falling on an object we wish to illuminate. That's where luminance and foot-candles comes into play. These are a measure of the light falling on an illuminated object. The design of the bulb - AND the current it draws and voltage it runs at (which = Watts) - are what determine the light it produces. The combination of the bulb and the optics used (reflector and/or lenticular front element - ie - lense) determine how much of the light actually gets to what we want to see.

I've done the measurements on LOTS of bulbs from lots of manufacturers. It's a PITA thing to do - it involved setting up a standard lighting fixture (from a BMW car) at a standard distance from a measurement pattern, and then lighting the bulb with a regulated voltage. The standards and regulation allows for repeated measurements - testing the same bulb multiple times produces the same results.

The pattern was a large grid - about 16' wide by 6' high - with measurements taken on a 6" grid. The measurements were taken with a calibrated lab foot-candle meter, which does "incident" (measures light falling on it - not reflected light as a normal photographic meter does) measurements... which eliminates variable in the surface the light is falling on.

The measurements were then plugged into Excel and surface plots of the intensity were done.

Anyway - long story - but the results were - good quality bulbs from manufacturers such as Osram, Hella and Bosch gave uniformly good results that met with the claims made by the manufacturers for the bulbs. Some of the manufacturers produce bulbs they claim provide 50% more light at the same power consumption. The bulbs tested met this claim, and didn't distort the light distribution pattern (ie - no hot spots..)

Most of the "blue" tinted bulbs did NOT meet the specifications the manufacturers gave, and some of them were woefully awful when compared to a used standard halogen bulb - putting out less light and a poor pattern of light.

None of the bulbs sold claiming 100W of power at 55W draw - actually did what was claimed. And some of the bulbs claiming they were consuming 100W of power - didn't. They actually consumed a measured 85W.

THAT is why I consider the use of "wattage" claims - 100W on 55W - such as PIAA uses - totally bogus.

All the good quality bulbs have ratings easily found for luminance, without exception. (Measured as the total light the bulbs put out). That was the exception for the bulbs I considered hype. The good quality bulbs also had lifetime specifications - which indicated that there is no free lunch, more luminance at the same power = shorter life. Again - no indication of this by the hyped bulbs manufacturers.

IMHO - Bling is bling - if it sounds too good to be true..

YMMV, but I've run the numbers on lighting and am fairly confident in them. They were published in the leading BMW car publication in the US - and NONE of the manufacturers denied or claimed my measurements were incorrect. Not a one - including the ones who were not favorably reviewed.

For anyone interested - the article is on-line: http://www.bmwcca.org/members/AM/Templa ... _E36_Light

[Max Continuous]

I just installed a PIAA bulb in my R1150R because the stock bulb was about as bright as a glade airwick candle.

My previous bike had a HID setup and that really is the way to go but the cost is quite a bit higher.

The PIAA bulb is much brighter than the stock bulb but not as great as all the marketing hype. It boils down to you get what you pay for. Swapping out the OEM bulb for a PIAA is a pretty cheap upgrade that does increase your visibility.

I am not a fan of the Kisan Headlight Modulator simply because I find it distracts an already situationally challenged cage driver. FWIW however, the Kisan Signal Minder will convert your indicator lights to also act as running lights which increases visibility during the day and also well after the sun goes down. Something a modulator won't do.

Best of luck with whatever you do.

[deilenberger]

Snippage..

I am not a fan of the Kisan Headlight Modulator simply because I find it distracts an already situationally challenged cage driver. FWIW however, the Kisan Signal Minder will convert your indicator lights to also act as running lights which increases visibility during the day and also well after the sun goes down. Something a modulator won't do.

Best of luck with whatever you do.

Actually - the Signal Minder will do absolutely nothing for a Hexhead (R1200R) - since there is no place to plug it in.

And - question - have you used a headlight modulator yourself? Are you speaking from personal experience or is this just theory?

[parkec]

OR


you could upgrade your head lamp // bulb with a pair of motolights

[deilenberger]

OR


you could upgrade your head lamp // bulb with a pair of motolights

Or other (and IMHO better) auxiliary lights..


Hella FF50's


Auxiliary Lights OFF

Auxiliary Lights ON

[parkec]

Torchee'