Spline & FD failures

[possum]

Curious to know how often final drive and clutch spline failures occur?

[AndyRR]

I did not suffer a total failure, but discovered what could be considered an impending spline failure at 35k miles. Tried a poll earlier here with no success. I has been difficult to measure how often the spline failure occurs. The fact that is has made frequent mention suggests that it is far too often. The extent is unknown. BMW prefers it that way.
At this point it is water under the bridge. A discontinued model with a failure that happens well after the warranty expires. I haven't heard of any failures with the r1200r. I suppose they fixed it, but perhaps the warranty is still in effect. Give it time.

[bikermeow]

There! ... I've voted. No failure.

and cos' I've voted thus I am expecting the failures to happen soon

.. it's all this thread's fault

[boxermania]

You will find that most of those that experienced the misfortune, have moved on to other models/brands.

[Trout]

You will find that most of those that experienced the misfortune, have moved on to other models/brands.

You got that right.

The bi-annual Iron Butt Rally is underway right now (11000 miles in 11 days). They are about halfway through. Of the 100 or so bikes, about 35% are BMW's, down from 43% in 2007. The decrease is mostly due to the abnormally high potential for these types of failures.

As of right now, one BMW is out of the rally for a final drive failure. It was interesting to note that 2 of the guys on BMW's are carrying spare final drive units. That fact alone speaks volumes to the nature of this problem and what it is doing to the BMW reputation among those who ride them hard.

In the long distance community, the guys that are abandoning BMW are going to Yamaha and Honda. No surprise there.

[duckdave]

I had to have the bushing that keeps the FD oil in from leaking out around the drive shaft into the rubber boot between the FD and the swing arm. Does that count as a FD failure?

It was an expensive repair. i could have kept topping it off, but it was leaking at a rate of 2 oz per 300 miles. Too much like a H-D for my taste.

[Trout]

Too much like a H-D for my taste.

Make fun if you like, but my 2 H-D's didn't leak a drop. I can't say the same for my 2 BMW's

[duckdave]

Sorry, that was an inappropriate generalization. I was thinking about my buddies in the 70s that always had to park their H-Ds over a pan or board to soak up the mess. I have heard they fixed that. Dog knows, BMW has been slow to fix their problems.

[Trout]

BMW has been slow to fix their problems.

Even worse, and the source of much of the frustration is that BMW has been slow (unwilling) to admit their problems, let alone fix them.

The boys who ride AMF Knucklehead Harleys expect their bikes to leak and they are proud that their bikes leak. Those of us who buy finely engineered German machinery have certain expectations that seem to be ignored by the mother ship.

Not to get off the topic of FD failures, but my friend just bought a 2008 K1200S, and he's experiencing a totally new kind of issue... the engine shuts off on hard decelleration. In searching the forums, he discovered that it's a very common complaint, and once again, BMW is unwilling to admit the problem. He took it to the dealer, they checked the codes, and shrugged their shoulders.

I'm just glad I didn't spend the full $17000 on my leaky beta version knucklehead-wanna-be bike

[possum]

Good points,I suppose I am trying to make a calculation...Is this problem going to happen to me? This is something I would like to avoid before my feelings about BMW are tainted. But I love my roadster,it does everything I ask of her.

[Trout]

Sorry to go slightly off topic again, but if you like adventure stories, you should be following the Iron Butt Rally at this website:

http://www.ironbuttrally.com/IBR/2009.cfm

RE: Final Drives - Here's an excerpt from the Day 8 Report Summary published earlier today:

Dave Biasotti is Still In the Rally, At Least for Now

After a previously reported final drive failure in Cripple Creek, Colorado, Dave Biasotti was able to make it to Checkpoint 2 due to the combined efforts of several individuals. Although the local BMW dealer was an extreme disappointment, BMW of Atlanta owner Bob Wooldridge coordinated the effort to get Dave back on the road via long distance. Matt Parkhouse volunteered his home and expertise to get a new final drive installed. Chris Lawson took the time to hand-deliver the new final drive obtained from Foothills BMW in Denver. Dan Huber stepped in when MoTow failed to respond in a timely manner and got Dave’s R1150RT towed to Matt’s home where the repair work was done.

Hopefully, all of this effort will be sufficient to get Dave to the finish in Spokane. However the new final drive already appeared to be leaking by the time Dave got to Santa Ana last night.

[MattPie]

Good points,I suppose I am trying to make a calculation...Is this problem going to happen to me? This is something I would like to avoid before my feelings about BMW are tainted. But I love my roadster,it does everything I ask of her.

Always remember that for every story you hear online, there's at least (probably) ten people that haven't had an issue. There have been a few here, but even if the rate was a epidemic-like 10%*, that's still only 1-in-10 chance that you're going to have an issue. I'll go with the odds and not worry until I have an issue.

If you want balance, I know a woman with over 71k on her 2005 R1150R with no issues.

* If it were 10%, I have to think we'd hear more about it, or there'd be a recall.

[kantuckid]

Exactly how worthwhile is the above poll, when no mileage is given? There is an online place to leave this information along with the many others who have had FD failures and it allows much more info. to be posted. I hinted at the idea of taking a FD along for my last trip to Mexico and was made fun of...

[possum]

Exactly how worthwhile is the above poll, when no mileage is given? There is an online place to leave this information along with the many others who have had FD failures and it allows much more info. to be posted. I hinted at the idea of taking a FD along for my last trip to Mexico and was made fun of...

Where is this online place you speak of.....

[sweatmark]

Where is this online place you speak of....

http://www.bmwfinaldrive.com/

I voted "no failures" [yet], but fully expect both systems to break during the long-term ownership of my Rockster. I'm greatly disappointed by BMW's irresponsibility, but like the basic design of the bike enough to invest in required repairs and upgraded parts when required.

I'm already budgeting the final drive rebuild, Paralever solid bushings, and a remedy for the spines problem. I removed my iABS long before it crapped out and love the resulting conventional brakes. I've cut most every wire tie off the bike and refit the wiring harness with my own ties, trying to avoid electrical problems. Got a spare clutch slave cylinder, heated grips set, long primary spark plug wires for stick coil relocation, and metal fuel line quick-connects that go on the bike at next OE part failure. And just got a good tip here on the board about installing beefier wiring for the Hall sensors!

Sure wish I didn't have to stock so much stuff in anticipation of OE part failures. But my bike's like an old pickup truck that will stay in the family, problems fixed as they occur or proactively solved, leaving a basic & functional machine. And like an old pickup, I don't mind kicking the crap out of it now that it's clearly defined as "imperfect when new".

[Trout]

Sure wish I didn't have to stock so much stuff in anticipation of OE part failures. But my bike's like an old pickup truck that will stay in the family, problems fixed as they occur or proactively solved, leaving a basic & functional machine. And like an old pickup, I don't mind kicking the crap out of it now that it's clearly defined as "imperfect when new".

I really like your philosophy.

Notwithstanding the issues with the factory, most modern BMW's are good for a long long time. For every guy with an issue, there are 4 other guys out there with 6 digits showing on the odometer. Even with the risk, there isn't really another main bike I'd rather have right now. That attitude might change if I get stranded on my 1500 mile ride this weekend

[BoxerSteve]

Got a spare clutch slave cylinder, heated grips set, long primary spark plug wires for stick coil relocation, and metal fuel line quick-connects that go on the bike at next OE part failure.

If I were you I would replace those QD's before they fail so you can avoid the horrid stains from gas that cannot be removed unless you repaint your engine/transmission cases. I had one of them fail and pour gas all over the side of my bike and I am really bummed about the stains that will not come out.

[sweatmark]

If I were you I would replace those QD's before they fail...

Been there. Our former R1150R Roadster (traded for F800S) suffered from fuel clamp gas spray syndrome, staining its silver drivetrain as you describe; such stains (and updated clamps) are the badges of courage we R1150-owners wear, along with the irony of "fine German engineering".

Broke an OE quick-connect on my Rockster and gas-stained the garage floor... I'm almost disappointed that the Rockster's black drivetrain hides the scars of fuel plumbing problems.

Will get a bit more time out of the original QC set before the metal versions (and new fuel hose and clamps) go in. Every time I pull the tank off (probably a good 30x for the Rockster), I liberally apply petroleum jelly to the QC halves and have had good results.

[R1150Rclean]

Only saw only one R1150R and one rockster failure in the http://www.bmwfinaldrive.com/ list

[R1150Rclean]

If I were you I would replace those QD's before they fail...

Will get a bit more time out of the original QC set before the metal versions (and new fuel hose and clamps) go in. Every time I pull the tank off (probably a good 30x for the Rockster), I liberally apply petroleum jelly to the QC halves and have had good results.

I think the QDs fail "just" due to age and temperature making the plastic brittle. I did not wait to replace them