not happy with BMW....

[Robert_winter_1000]

I must say, I have learned a lesson, buy used, and save!

Well OU812 I don’t agree with you. I buy the bike because I love it and I don’t expect any financial advantages out of it. If you buy it 2nd hand you will have no idea about the history of it. Having a maintenance book doesn’t say enough. You will have warranty for few months and after that you have to find it out yourself. If you have the time and the fun to work with it then it is not a problem, but I don’t have them both . I bought my 02 R1150R new. Now he has 35K km and still he is as perfect as the new. When he will start making problems I will trade him with another new.
Regards
Robert

[OU812]

Ok, let's see. I bought my 04 last August for $6400.(2400 miles, with extras) And sold my 02 for $6400.(14K miles) The owner of the 04 paid $9600 from a dealer less than 1 year prior. Jeez, you must be right!

[tourer]

Here in northern New England, the Rocksters hold their value well, all BMW's do. It must be a regional thing.
I love my edition 80, I have been offered more than I payed for it.
Low mileage Rocksters sell for $9500 to $10,000 around here.
ABS Edition 80's bring another $1000 to $1500.

[Robert_winter_1000]

OU812, you are right..but don't forget I am not buying and selling..I just want a good bike to ride..that is it..
Robert

[OU812]

I commend you on your choice of motorcycles. I too buy to ride. I just have a hard time paying more then I have to. My bike fell into my arms, so to speak. I will admit, I did things to the bike differently this time around, like a second marriage!

[Marku]

ranmar850,

I believe you made the mistake the day you purchased your bike. Which in my mind has absolutely NOTHING to do with the BMW dealership or BMW.
What I do agree with is that most sales people are scum. Just take it as learning experience. I wasn't happy with my dealership either from where I bought my bike. And the people in my new town in the new BMW dealership are snobby aswell.

IMO,
The problem is alot of North Americans think BMW = rich bastard into exotic toys. I'll tell you I'm first generation German-Canadian and alot of my family in Germany have BMW's and they're not rich or snobby. In Germany a BMW is just a normal car. Just like Ford, but way better . Bottom line is BMW make great things and I don't care what a sales person says.

Selling private is always the smartest thing to do anyways. Even if you own a mint condition Steinway Piano you're going to lose money if you trade it in, at a dealer. But more possible to make profit privately.

[Damo]

Ranmar850, just FYI I traded my '03 80Ed around 6 mnths ago here in Brisbane. First I went to a Yamaha/Suzuki/Triumph dealers out of interest. All offered me $10k trade on bikes worth around $18k. I was resigned to keeping her when I voiced an interest in a K12R at my BMW dealer. He offered just under $14k trade, and the rest is history. They sold my Ed80 a couple of months later. Sure, you are more isolated on the west coast, but you can bet that someone wants her.

Damo

[ranmar850]

Lots of good discussion here, and I certainly agree with most of it
* buy s/hand, and you lose less. Absolutely--particularly with cars, let someone else take the initial depreciation hit. Big believer in buying something 2yo, low miles, and cross the fingers. So why did I buy the Rock new? Heart, not head, and a misguided belief in resale values holding up. Well, hell, look at what the BMW dealer was asking for s/handers But they weren't Rocks.
* If everything depreciates at the same rate, you will lose more in actual dollars. Obviously. I remember buying a T500 Suzuki $920 otd. Sold it 2 good years later for $600. Thats 35%. But only $320. Which, at the time was probably 3 weeks net pay And now I'm complaining about getting about a weeks less net pay on my trade-in now than I wanted
* I don't consider cars or bikes assets.Well, not the positive kind-more like money pits. OK, my Norton is worth a lot more than when I bought it 7 years ago, but that isn't why I bought it, and I don't care what I am offered, I'm keeping it. Bikes are for the heart.
* I intended to keep this bike a very long time, too, but needs ( or maybe just perceptions of them) change. My wife and I (25yrs married) want to share the riding more, instead of me going off every Sunday. We shared it for 2 enjoyable weeks on a 1200GS last year, and want to do more of it. In fact, that bike is probably responsible for this, a little; oilhead felt a bit ordinary when I got home. And the Rocks pillion seat ain't great. Two separate passengers have attested to this.

So lets sum this up--I f**cked up by buying an unpopular model( at least around here)
I am selling it too soon
I may have had SLIGHTLY unrealistic expectations.
I still think that dealer is a bastard
My initial reaction was probably due to thwarted hopes. I had set myself a limit on changeover cost, and it didn't come inside that. Looked at in the cold light of day, after the red mist had cleared , it's only a grand and a half less than I would have taken. WTF. Why don't I just do it. I'm certainly good for it .Trying to be financially responsible, I guess. Might ring that Yamaha dealer back...

[sjbmw]

Break the cycle and buy a used FJR.

[ranmar850]

Break the cycle and buy a used FJR.

As usual, the voice of reason. there is always that option

[fnfalman]

And if you were to buy a used bike, please don't come and cry about something not right on it.

[dragonmojo]

Here's another take:

If I were to sell one of my bikes and figure the difference from what it cost me new, divide that by the number of miles I enjoyed on it, I will derive an estimate of what it cost me per mile of joy (or hardship).

(orig_cost - sell_cost) / odo_reading


Judging from what I've seen in the resale ads, it has cost me less than 15 cents per mile.

[Robert_winter_1000]

And if you were to buy a used bike, please don't come and cry about something not right on it.

fnfalman, I completely agree with you. Everybody should know what he/she wants.

regards

Robert

[Brownw3]

BMW's are exotic, and the Rockster was one of the exoticest. I bought my Rockster, brand new, just a few dealer miles, ABS, Touring Cases, Tank bag, passenger comfort seat, heated grips for $10,000 all in. Now I'd be lucky to get $8000 for the bike.

BMW owners are odd ducks. I've known many that will darn near give away a bike to get the latest and greatest. This does not help market values. ALso, your typical used Beemer has scads and scads of miles on it but still run like new. Why pay $8000 for a used Rockster when I can pay $6500 for a fully loaded RTP that will still run until the cows come home? Its a funny market for exotics. Guys either want one or they don't and I'll stress the Rockster was not a popular bike (although I love mine)

An option is to mod your bike into a tourer and this is easy, some motolights, seat, handlebars, an autocom, bags, etc and you're ready to go. I'm a big guy and after mods I'm very comfy crossing state lines.

Anyway, I wouldn't be displeased with BMW, they certainly don't sit around the dealerships and lie about resale.

[OU812]

You can tour with a Rockster/Roadster. Add J-pegs,and you will be comfy for miles of smiles! This is mine.

[duke]

... or buy pre-registered bike (mine is Rockster too) from dealership which is about to close ...

price new with the options (ABS, heated grips) - nearly £8.6k,

price pre-registered with 0 miles on the clock - £6.5k ...

no brainer really


but ... next time ... it will be a R1200GS or a LC8 based KTM (not my "super" namesake one, if you catch my drift )

[ranmar850]

... or buy pre-registered bike (mine is Rockster too) from dealership which is about to close ...

price new with the options (ABS, heated grips) - nearly £8.6k,

price pre-registered with 0 miles on the clock - £6.5k ...

no brainer really


but ... next time ... it will be a R1200GS or a LC8 based KTM (not my "super" namesake one, if you catch my drift )

You should remember that the advice you give on an international forum, even if it seems like a "no brainer" to you , may be entirely irrelevant in another country. I have seen a lot of this pre-registration mentioned in English publications (big fan of BIKE uk), but we have no equivilant here in Oz. Closest would be a demo model, but I'm sure you do that, anyway. Bikes will obviously be discounted after the end of a model year, or discounted prior to a model change if there looks like being too much carryover stock. Again, I'm sure that happens in the UK too. As for the term MSRP, in the US, I am assuming that it correlates to recommended retail price here. The usual selling price, dealers never charge more. Yet I see a lot of talk of dealers asking over MSRP on models they percieve to be in demand. I would like to be enlightened here if I am on the wrong track.

Point is, so often , advice proffered may be useless to the recipient--just look at the users address first

[OU812]

Some of the dealers here can print up any "invoice" they want. I have seen them ask more for certain select models when they first come out. :evil MSRP (Manufactures suggested retail price). Note the SUGGESTED, can change without notice. I always loved that one.

[duke]

... or buy pre-registered bike (mine is Rockster too) from dealership which is about to close ...

price new with the options (ABS, heated grips) - nearly £8.6k,

price pre-registered with 0 miles on the clock - £6.5k ...

no brainer really


but ... next time ... it will be a R1200GS or a LC8 based KTM (not my "super" namesake one, if you catch my drift )

You should remember that the advice you give on an international forum, even if it seems like a "no brainer" to you , may be entirely irrelevant in another country. I have seen a lot of this pre-registration mentioned in English publications (big fan of BIKE uk), but we have no equivilant here in Oz. Closest would be a demo model, but I'm sure you do that, anyway. Bikes will obviously be discounted after the end of a model year, or discounted prior to a model change if there looks like being too much carryover stock. Again, I'm sure that happens in the UK too. As for the term MSRP, in the US, I am assuming that it correlates to recommended retail price here. The usual selling price, dealers never charge more. Yet I see a lot of talk of dealers asking over MSRP on models they percieve to be in demand. I would like to be enlightened here if I am on the wrong track.

Point is, so often , advice proffered may be useless to the recipient--just look at the users address first

-=+* Rant start *+=-

I have seen the locations and read the thread carefully.

I am afraid you take my words too literally, and make a lot of assumptions yourself about my situation.
I was just sharing my personal experience.

My words were in principle. If you think that I was having a dig at anyone - this forum is the last place I would do this.

In UK BMW as a rule do not discount bikes.
Although it happens - it must be exception rather than the rule (K1200R excluded, that must be a rule).
Same with pre-register.

This bike was a one-off, as they messed up their documentation and got forced by BMW UK to declare it ex-demo with 0 miles on the clock.

Again - for BMW - the above is exception, and not rule in UK.

However I think the following to be universal truth:

Unless you want the latest and flashiest kit - try to buy stock when it is due to become EOL.
Try to buy from dealership about to close, or change ownership.
The principal dealer will try to dump as much stock as possible,
as the new owners will not like the sight of too many traded-in or ex-demo bikes.
Try to buy when it is end of financial quarter, or even better - end of financial year.
I do not know how this works abroad (in comparison to UK),
but here this type of information is publicly available (albeit for small charge if I am not mistaken).
Dealers work on commission and then it is good time to squeeze them.
Sell your bike in the spring and try to buy near the beginning of winter.


Personal circumstances vary between people and places.
However I think anyone is entitled to have their £0.02, even if they do not live in the same country.
It is down to the individual to make their mind and see if this applies to them.
It is a free BMW world - "innit?"

-=+* Rant over *+=-

I hope you do not take this personally, or think this is a beginning of a flame war.
All the best with your trade-in and search for the best bike for you and that elusive biking nirvana.

[ranmar850]

No offence taken, and I hope , none given.It's just that, time and time again, I've seen this happen. But, hell, more the merrier.I agree with everything you say re times to buy and sell. Even though our winter here is much milder than yours, bike sales do drop away--IMO, it's the best time to ride. Particularly as it never really seems to rain any more. Summer up our way tends to get too hot, often, for enjoyable riding. But things pick up in the spring, sales wise. I'm selling at the wrong time/buying at the right time. BTW, Superdukes are going for $14,990 here at the moment, ahead of the new model--$4,000 off. I'd love one in the shed; along with the Rockster and the tourer I want

Keep buying those lotto tickets...