Teen Agers first bike - advice please

[JCsman]

My 15 year old son wants a car (of course) for his 16th birthday. But he also wants a motorcycle. I would have a hard time saying no. His mother used to ride, both his brothers and, of course, I ride. He plans to sell his (beloved) ATV to help fund the bike.

When I was a youth (and dinosaurs ruled the earth) there were a ton of small bikes for beginners. Honda CB160s on up to BIG bike like a SUPER Hawk 305, etc. But similar bikes are almost unavailable today.

I know there was a thread about how the R1150R is a good first bike, but I want my kid to begin with something that breaths a little less fire. I want him to be able to stay ahead of traffic, but am not looking for a performance bike at this stage. I don't worry about him outgrowing the bike too soon because his mother has a renewed interest and may adopt his bike when and if he's ready to move up.

Oddly enough I tried to get him interested in dirt bikes, but he was too happy on his ATV to swap. But the idea of a street bike has his interest.

FYI he's a good sized kid (5' 9" and 168 pounds). A pretty smart kid, but, as with most 15 years olds knows everything and is invulnerable. His rides would mostly be very local. Even school is about 10 miles mostly rural roads and nothing posted over 55 mph.

I've got several months before he's 16 so I'm just beginning the sorting process. I'm toying with the idea of something from the following list. All are available on the used market at acceptable prices. Here are my candidates and some quick thoughts. Your advice would be most welcome:

Kawasaki KLR 250. A limited dirt bike and limited street bike, but he could get some valuable off-roads practice/skills. Is this bike capable enough on the street? (I've about eliminated other 250s as too limited for a kid his size, but the off road issue keeps the KLR on the list.)

Suzuki GS500 (the naked version). Supposed to be bulletproof. Not too quick for a 500. I also hear the suspension is a little soft.

Kawasaki EX 500. I'm not too fond of the amount of plastic (costly in case of a fall). But I once owned a 454LTD (cruiser version of similar motor) and the engine is a peach. I suspect he'd love the looks.

Buell Blast. Pretty slow, but that's OK by me. There are no local Buell dealers (our local H-D does not carry them).

[BobFV1]

My oldest son (20) started out with a cheap Korean scooter, then at age 18 he bought himself a new Kawasaki Ninja 250, which he still has as a "spare". It's been a great bike for him. He has since purchased a Suzuki RF-600 as his main bike and he has his beady little eyes on my Ducati!

[new2BMW]

Bill;
Without knowing your boy's experience level, it is hard to say. However, generally speaking I lean towards the KLR for several reasons.

Wide bars.
Control is everything for a new rider. Wider bars provide good control but can forgive over zealous inputs.

He can explore some fun things off road that he shouldn't be doing on the street. Trust me, he will attempt wheelies, stoppies and other antics. With your guidance he can learn to enjoy these things in their proper place.

Chances are that the KLR weighs less than the street bikes. I don't know about you, but this was important for my learning experience.

Good luck with your choice.
Jeff

[JCsman]

Bill;
Without knowing your boy's experience level, it is hard to say.

Motorcycle level = 0. He's ridden a buddy's dirt bike just a couple of times.

Of course he rides a bicycle and the ATV I've mentioned.

You are right about the wheelies/stoppies, etc.

His ATV is a standard model, yet I see him take moderate jumps, slide the back around corners, and so forth.

The wieght of the KLR is a good point.

Bob, I know what you mean. He's already asking when he can ride my R1150R.

Any more thoughts appreciated as well.

[JToole]

Kawasaki KLR 250. A limited dirt bike and limited street bike, but he could get some valuable off-roads practice/skills. Is this bike capable enough on the street? (I've about eliminated other 250s as too limited for a kid his size, but the off road issue keeps the KLR on the list.)

I agree with the dually idea. It should have enough "cool" to hold him for a while and still stay in the starter bracket. I wouldn't be afraid of something in the 500 range either (Having grown up from a moped I have HUGE fears of being out in traffic on something that can't get out of it's own way - let alone that truck!). Besides, if you rural roads are anything like they are in Ohio, that off-road capability will come in handy!

The Blast! is a great starter bike but don't underestimate it. A friend of mine got one this summer as a starter bike and boy will that thing corner! It may be the bottom of the line for Buell but it IS still a Buell! Lots of torque, too. If he wants a BMW like yours someday maybe that is a good starting point. Don't be suprised if he starts to outrun Dad in the tight twisties, though! You can pick up one 1-3 years old and low miles for about $2500 (around here at least).

Riding. Now there's a great father-son activity! Talk about quality time!

[dallara]

Personally, I believe in as much off-road riding experience as possible before you ever turn someone loose on the street. Despite what many seem to believe, motorcycles are not the easiest vehicles to operate, and as such one should not be thrown into traffic until the basic operating dynamics are learned, and learned well. Dirt bikes are the world's best teachers in this regard, and the dirt is by comparison a most forgiving teacher.

I'd say a year of dirt riding before your child is allowed on pavement...

But that's just my two cents... YMMV.

Cheers!

Dallara

[bikerdudeQC]

Any thoughts to just saying no? At 27, I still remember 16 very well. Also, as I am on the verge of starting my own family, this is something that I’ve been thinking about. Personally I would not have wanted my 16 year old self to be riding a bike. I was a very responsible 16 year old: part time job, near the top of my class, only drank a bit, did pot twice. Not holding myself up as a model, just helping with the profile. However, when I was that age, neither my friends nor myself had any concept of mortality. When you believe the price is risk taking is low you take high risks. It’s really that simple.

As a son of a motorcyclist I naturally wanted to ride, I expect my children may feel the same way. The deal that I’ve pretty much worked out with my unborn children is that they are free ride once they can afford to do buy a bike themselves including paying for plates, gas, insurance, maintenance – everything. Though the details have yet to be worked out, the gist of my rules will be to make the purchase expensive enough to delay it. E.g the bike has to be new, and non crotch rockety and other rules we will come up with. In my case, that worked out to be around 22 which is when I bought my F650CS.

But this is just my solution, sorry for drifting off topic a bit. As I said this is an issue that I’ve been thinking about and am curious what you guys think.

Cheers,

Justin

[BobFV1]

Any thoughts to just saying no?
Justin

Hey Justin -

I have some thoughts on that - it did not work for me with my oldest son. He moved out of the house as soon as he graduated and was very independent and over my strong protests got the scooter. I was horrified. Then he got the Ninja. I did not approve, but soon I found him out with guys my age from the music store he worked at in the Wahington, DC metro area "learning" how to ride from them. That was it. I enrolled him in the BRC, then I took him in tow on a cross-country ride, and in two weeks I will be taking him to his third track day (I go every month but he lives across the country from me so I fly him in for these events.)

If you can't beat them, sometimes you have no chice but to join them. My younger son, an 18 year-old college freshman, took the BRC but could not be less interested in riding or having his own bike. Go figure?

[rdsmith3]

I have a son who will be 16 in two weeks. Yikes!

I am uneasy about him riding. Where I live, just driving a car requires a lot of concentration. There is so much traffic around here; so many distractions; so many bad drivers to be wary of.

I want my son to get comfortable driving a car before we talk about a motorcycle.

I think off road is a great option. I wish that were viable around here.

Best wishes to your son.

[JCsman]

Any thoughts to just saying no?

The deal that I’ve pretty much worked out with my unborn children is that they are free ride once they can afford to do buy a bike themselves including paying for plates, gas, insurance, maintenance – everything. Though the details have yet to be worked out, the gist of my rules will be to make the purchase expensive enough to delay it. E.g the bike has to be new, and non crotch rockety and other rules we will come up with. In my case, that worked out to be around 22 which is when I bought my F650CS.

Justin

Yep, I sure have thought of saying, "No". In fact a line my son is sick of hearing is, "Sure you can, when you're 22 and living on your own". And John will be expected to pay for gas, insurance and miscelleneous expenses.

To all others, thanks. The collected wisdom of the board is much appreciated. I must admit I've been leaning towards the KLR so John can ride the dirt around here for (relatively - at least no traffic) safe practice. He can't ride on streets here until 16 (well he can, but the permitted bikes are almost all scooter/moped by legislation). Plus I'd like some light duty trail time myself when he's off the bike.

I believe I'll start looking for the KLR for sale.

If there are any more thoughts, I'll be glad to ponder some more. Thanks again.

[dallara]

He might scream JCsman, but...

I wouldn't pop for the KLR just yet. Even a dual-purpose 250 is a pretty big scoot to cut your teeth on off-road.

Personally, for first bikes I like Honda XR-100's... Well, now Honda calls 'em CRF-100's. No bike can teach you more quicker than a Honda 100, and nothing is more reliable or easier to sell. Find one used and you can use it for another great teaching tool - how to maintain and "fix-up" anything it needs to bring it back up to full operating capacity, i.e. if it needs having the carb gone through from sitting up, needs a new chain or sprockets, etc. that you would have to work on a little...

You can find them used all over the place, and they are incredibly easy to sell when it is time to move up. They hold their value pretty well after the first buyer takes the "new bike" depreciation hit, too.

If you think that is too small, Honda makes a CRF-150 and a CRF-230. They have made similar 125, 150, 200, and 230cc models for the past few years so they are still easy to find used and inexpensive - and you can't break one with a sledgehammer and conventional explosives!

Point is - start him off in the dirt, and dirt only, for a year. He will be a much better street rider for it in the end, and you will sleep easier in years to come because you did it that way. Like Tom sizemore said in "Blackhawk Down" - "Out on the street, it's unforgiving..."

Besides, latch onto a good Honda XR/CRF and you are liable to never want to sell it... Just keep it around in the garage for years to come for a playbike.

Just my two cents... And only because I want to see your son around riding for decades and decades to come.

Cheers!

Dallara

[R4R&R]

Kawi ZX250.

[DJ Downunder]

Yamaha XT 250 http://www.yamaha-motor.com.au/motor/pr ... delcatid=3

A good first all rounder.

DJ

[JToole]

JC,

It sounds like you've definitely made the decision to get him something. Good! They say there's no greater teacher than experience and I believe that's true. I'll also say there's no better person with whom to get that experience than "dear old Dad"!

I've related to the board many times how I taught my son, Clint to shoot from a young age. Now that I am on the verge of losing my own father I realize that the best memories I have of him were the times he was teaching me at the range. Now that Clint is nearly 14 I'm thinking about adding riding to the (hopefully) fond memories he'll have. Besides, isn't it the father's place to teach the son survival? It's one of the last bastions of tradition we men have in this PC world...

Since you are leaning toward the "dirtier" selections, let me suggest this: Budget yourself a nice dirt bike, too! How better to give those tips and be there for the inevitable (and hopefully minor) spills than to ride together? Besides, you know you'll have a ball in the dirt, too!

...and OBTW, a set of those bike-to-bike intercoms would come in handy, too. E-Bay a good used set...

[Doug]

I recommend you send him to a MSF course. http://www.msf-usa.org/

[JCsman]

I recommend you send him to a MSF course. http://www.msf-usa.org/

Absorootypolutley!

We're planning to both go next spring. Me to unlearn bad habits, him to develop good ones. (He should have the easier time of that!)

[captainK]

When I was your son's age everybody -- and I do mean EVERYBODY -- learned to ride on a Honda stepthru of some kind. Advantages were that they were light and didn't need any effort to balance at stoplights etc., and that the auto clutch allowed new riders to concentrate on their roadcraft before moving on to something a little bigger.

Fast forward 30+ years and now, at my home in Bangkok, we have a ... 100cc Honda stepthru (in addition to my ol' R80). (Bought the Honda one day when I couldn't find a taxi and I was standing right next to a bike shop, so paid for it with a credit card and rode home!) My teenage daughter also likes the concept of riding a bike, so when she was about 13 we let her loose on the Honda around the large carpark next to our home. She soon became pretty proficient. Now she's 17 -- she loves both my Beemers, but realises that she needs to work her way up to bigger bikes. So she's got her eye on the newer generation of scooters: Vespas, Aprilias, etc. I agree -- they're a lot more interesting and capable than they used to be -- more power, better brakes, etc. -- and I'd be quite OK with her learning to ride on one before moving up to "proper" motorcycles.

Now comes the hard part -- convincing her mother!

Obviously every kid has his/her idea of what's cool, but I can only agree with everybody who is advising that something small/light/modest power is the way to go for a first bike. Hardly surprising that in many countries that approach is mandatory anyway.


Captain K.

[ken k]

I think one of the new "mega-scooters" would be a great start. suzuki Burgman 400 or the Honda Reflex 400 Yamaha Majesty 400.

Suzuki also makes a Boulevard crusier 650 It used to be called Savage 650. It is a single cylinder 650. nice low seat height and easy power to handle. Pretty cheap and just about every dealer has a used one in stock.

Yamaha made a Virago 535 also and Honda has the Rebel 250. All low seat cruisers.

Honda also makes a 250 Nighthawk with the same engine as the rebel but in a regular standard frame.

Defenitely not a BMW R for a first bike, at least for a teenage beginner.

I also recommend the MSF course.

ken k

[The Kurch Man]

I take the MSF Exp Rider course every couple of years myself. I strongly believe in them for ANY person new on the saddle or getting back on the saddle after a while.

As for a bike, you have lots of ideas tossed at you. Don't discount a HD Sportster (stop laughing for all of the anti HDers out there). The kid won't be as tempted to go for the thrill ride that he might be with a metric sport bike and if he does, the bike will let him feel like he is going 70 when he is doing 50.

[Nwild]

My Uncle had a great rule for his step son, after 1 full year of driving a car with no tickets and no accidents he would help him get his motorcycle drivers license.