I sure could have used ABS on my '05 today!

[Harry]

Traveling north of Urbana Maryland on Frederick road this afternoon I had my closest call in years.

There was no cars behind or in front of me and I was coming around a
blind curve at about 60 mph. That *is* fast, but I've traveled that
road dozens of times and I *thought* I knew what to expect.

Just as soon as I came through the curve I saw a maroon Suburban
pulling out from a little dirt road on the right that I didn't even
know existed!

Luckily I keep my thumb on my horn at all times and I used it. The
truck pulled out about half way into the road and I locked-up my rear
brake (I wish that I had had anti lock brakes in that instant). My
bike went into this crazy wobble/skid before I was able to let my foot off of my brake pedal. Thank God the truck stopped and there wasn't any oncoming traffic at the time because I had to swerve across the double yellow to avoid hitting it. I missed the front of his truck by about four feet.

But if I hadn't been going that fast, I wouldn't have even been in
that situation.

Even when I'm not intending to, the speed just
kind of sneaks up on me.

My safety training saved me today. It was pure instinct; horn, brake, swerve.

I've got to slow down though! Damn R. It always wants me to go faster!!

*PHEW*

[DJ Downunder]

I have a tip for you...never...use the rear brake...

It's good for when you're stopped at a red light facing up a hill to stop rolling back...and that's about it.

Oh..and maybe slow speed U turns...but that's all....and maybe ice...but that's it.

Yeah I know others will say they use it for slowing for a corner...but I don't even do that..it's just too easy to lock up.

Glad you've ok and thanks for the post... ...of corse this is only my opinion and I'm no expert...

DJ

[leno]

The brakes are linked so if you use the front the back will come on as well. So you don't have to think about adding a bit of back to balance the bike. But on the open road the back brake on it's own is not going to save your bacon. The brakes on this bike are amazing and will pull you up.

[R4R&R]

The brakes are linked so if you use the front the back will come on as well. So you don't have to think about adding a bit of back to balance the bike. But on the open road the back brake on it's own is not going to save your bacon. The brakes on this bike are amazing and will pull you up.

I think only the ABS brakes are partially linked. No ABS=no linked brakes. I have ABS with the servo powered brakes and while I think it's been handy to have in certain situations, I probably wouldn't buy them again. Maybe I would. Well, I might get ABS, but would rather pass on the server power. I'm kind of undecided - can you tell?

Good thing you saved it. How fast was the turn - was it 60mph in a 45mph rated turn?

[Boxer]

Been there, done that. We all have, and hopefully we survive and learn from the experience. I still don't like the idea of ABS on bikes.

[Oilhead]

First of all, you are lucky you didn't highside when you release the locked up rear brakes! That being said, I am glad you are OK.

I agree with DJ on the rear brakes. They lock up so easily it's pretty much a joke. Sometimes I'll give them a light stab just to lock them up on purpose just for laughs.
Like DJ, I certainly don't use the crappy rear brakes when I have to stop suddenly. I do however use them to slow down under normal conditions.

I am planning to install Spiegler SS brake lines for the rear. This should improve the feel tremendously and make it much easier to modulate the rear. If I like it, I will install it in the front also.

[beemerphile]

I agree with DJ on the rear brakes.

Me too. Use them as hill holders. My R100RT with 120K miles on it has the original rear pads.

You might pick up a copy of Keith Code's "Twist of the Wrist" books or videos (or both). In his view, you only have a certain amount of concentration available (he equates it as $10 to spend) and spending it trying to modulate the rear brake means it can't be spent plotting a path out of the danger zone by steering the motorcycle. Keith was a riding coach to Wayne Rainey who was probably one of the best GP racers ever. Most of the "I had to lay it down" stories are actually "I applied too much rear brake and the bike swapped ends on me and fell down". In addition to avoiding the servo abomination, un-linked brakes are another good reason not to check the ABS box on the order form. - Lee

[dwayne]

I have a tip for you...never...use the rear brake...

It's good for when you're stopped at a red light facing up a hill to stop rolling back...and that's about it.

Oh..and maybe slow speed U turns...but that's all....and maybe ice...but that's it.

Yeah I know others will say they use it for slowing for a corner...but I don't even do that..it's just too easy to lock up.

Glad you've ok and thanks for the post... ...of corse this is only my opinion and I'm no expert...

DJ

Motorcycles have a rear brake??

Seriously though, I think I have used my rear brake once, and that was to hold the bike on a hill so I could firm up my chin strap.

[dwayne]

...of corse this is only my opinion and I'm no expert...

DJ

No, but you did stay at a Best Western last night.

[drevil]

not positive, maybe someone can confirm, but i heard the other day at the dealer that the r1150r abs is partially linked meaning the front activates the rear, bt the rear doesn't apply the front. otherwise they would be fully linked. like dj i only use the rear brake to stay stopped when strectching my hands at lights and such and sometimes to slightly drag into a turn, but i'm even losing that habit.

the best part about your experience is that you are ok. the second best is that you didn't panic and do something stupid like lay the bike down. the stupidest thing i have ever heard is "i had the lay it down. why would anyone lay the bike down intentionally? once the wheels are off the ground there is no stopping your momentum. basically you are bailing out of the situation in a panic. you have a much better chance if you keep your head and apply brakes for a panic stop JUST LIKE YOU HAVE PRACTICED!!!! (or at least you should be practicing it!!!)

[rockster.ch]

there's a back brake?!?
and ABS/front brake is good enough to make one's nuts two-dimensional

[leno]

Yep the front does both and the back only the back. I total agree witn the 'I had to lay it down'. Why would you want to slide under a truck/car?

[collyers]

Yep the front does both and the back only the back.

Only true if you have ABS/Servo brakes - which Harry doesn't have.

[drevil]

ahhhh. my rock has the servos. so the regular r1150r's don;t have servos and are fully linked?

[popgazer]

I have a tip for you...never...use the rear brake...

A little bit of physics why rear brakes are useless in hard braking. When braking hard the weight shifts toward the front of the bike, putting most of the pressure on the front wheel. There's little or no pressure on the back wheel, as can be seen in the extreme case of hard braking when the back wheel completely leaves the ground, it literally lifts off. With less pressure there is less traction between the rubber and the road surface. Less traction means less or no braking power. So, the rear wheel braking isn't contributing much to slowing/stopping hard.
Also, due to less (or no) pressure on the wheel, there's less force driving the wheel to turn, thus any amount of braking may lock it!
Conclusion: when braking hard, there are no advantages to using the back brake, but there are drawbacks.
Straightening the bike up, on the other hand is probably the next most important action in braking hard, possibly even before attempting to brake.
The horn works well in the case the other driver has time to notice you and take action. I wouldn't count on it for emergency stopping.
Between the time one sees a danger is ahead and one actions the horn, there's a 600 ms lag. That's how fast we can process the information and decide which action to take.
At 60 mph a vehicle has already come about 17 yards (16.5 m) closer to the danger zone. If it takes only as twice as much time for the driver to notice and take action, and even when you have slowed down to 30 mph, you have still come closer to the danger zone by at least another 17 yards.

[socalrob]

Pay attention here:

If you have servos you have ABS brakes that are partially linked, front applies both, rear applies rear only.

Both Rockster & Roadster come with and without ABS brakes. If you don't here servo whine & you don't have an ABS sensor rings (slotted ring smaller than the brake rotor) then you don't have ABS.

No R1150R's have full linked brakes like the RT's, where the rear pedal applies the front brake.

If you don't have ABS brakes you don't have linked brakes or servos.

[Harry]

All good advice! I've been riding BMW's for 15 years, so I'm no novice. And I didn't *used* to use my rear brake much at all. As a matter of fact, I put 50k on my K75 without ever having to change my rear brake pads.

But I gradually got into a bad habit of rear braking after experiencing a few front tire "flubs" while braking hard in the rain. My thinking at the time was that if my *front* tire goes, I'd definitely crash!

Also, using the rear brake was just, well... easier!

I've got to retrain myself and get back to using that front brake!

[beemerphile]

My thinking at the time was that if my *front* tire goes, I'd definitely crash!

If you lock the front wheel you will definitely crash eventually. My experimentation on several different bikes over many years shows that if you lock the front wheel (while upright, not while turning) that you have almost exactly one second to get off of it before the bars slam to lock and the bike goes greasy side up. It is amazing how repeatable the one second is on gravel, wet roads, oil slicks, different bikes, etc. One second doesn't sound like much, but is plenty of time to back off and get another grip on the front brake. You can easily sense the point at the end of the second that some force other than you is about to take control the handlebars and "it" wants to see you crash. Here's something else to consider. When you lock the rear brake (which is much easier to do) then the rear end starts around almost immediately and the result of getting off of the rear brake can instantly flick the bike (and you) into the weeds like a booger.

Recap: Regardless of traction (good, limited, wet, dry, oily, etc.)...

1) The front brake provides much more stopping power
2) The front brake does not lock up as easily
3) If the front does lock you have more recovery time
4) Releasing the front brake stabilizes rather than destabilizes the bike

Lee

[duke]

Someone pulls on you, you mandatory give them the horn, they brake, you crash in them because they have stopped in your path.

Or

Someone pulls on you, you mandatory give them the horn, they brake, you avoid them because you are lucky they have not pulled completely.

I would rather concentrate on the braking ... you can give them the horn and show them two fingers once you overtake them.

My $0.02

[leno]

Someone pulls on you, you mandatory give them the horn, they brake, you crash in them because they have stopped in your path.

Or

Someone pulls on you, you mandatory give them the horn, they brake, you avoid them because you are lucky they have not pulled completely.

I would rather concentrate on the braking ... you can give them the horn and show them two fingers once you overtake them.

My $0.02

I save the horn for people that are thinking about pulling out on me. If they are not thinking but doing then it's straight to the brake then the horn and Paddington hard stares.