Battery charger (could this be the new "OIL?")

mnnden · Post by **mnnden** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 8:38 pm

Anyone know if I can use this charger on my gel battery? Thanks, Den

Post by **Beemeridian** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 8:43 pm

Post by **Boxer** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 8:56 pm

Edited for content

Post by **Beemeridian** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 9:08 pm

Post by **Biff's R** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 9:53 pm

The BMW charger is made by Deltran. The make the Battery Tender, and there were 2 different model #s. One was for lead/acid batteries and AGM. The other was for gel batteries. It is something to do with the rate of charge on the different cycles.

The one you have looks exactly like the one I have my bike hooked to.

geothepencil · Post by **geothepencil** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 10:17 pm

Not to confuse anybody, but I have two of those and they both look exactly the same except one is for gels and the other one is for everything else. The gel charger has a sticker that says PROGRAMMED FOR GEL BATTERIES.

My guess is that the one in the picture is not the one for gels but I don't know for sure.

Call Deltran tomorrow and ask them. You might get lucky and get an answer.

geo

Arbee · Post by **Arbee** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 2:20 am

Joke

What did the Gel battery say to the BMW Alternator
No No not without a condom

End of joke and beginning a new one...

You see the alternator does not know what a gel battery is and will charge all the way up to 10 amps if that is what is required by the sensing network regulator.

The charge rate of that charger is 1.25 amps which is a trickle charger
and can be used on a gel battery because it is low amperage.

I also offer a challenge to any gel battery charging manufacturer
who can convince me that a BMW alternator goes easy on a gel battery like their special gel battery chargers do.

Post by **MikeCam** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 5:42 am

Have fun boys. There are facts available to any who actually wish to answer the question.

Do some battery research to determine why gel style batteries require a different absorption rate and a different float charge voltage to maintain peak lifetime performance versus absorbed gas mat (AGM) batteries.

Then visit the Deltran site to see why the BMW branded, Deltran Gel charger is a superior solution to charging that battery (and along the way, understand that the alternator does not charge the battery, it simply passes an available voltage along to a smart circuit that regulates the charge into the battery).

Finally, you might learn that any 12 volt, low amperage charger can charge any similar battery but that battery life and optimal performance are enhanced by using the right charger (and using it the right way).

To the original poster. You can use that charger on a gel battery. It will work but it is not the best solution. It gives a 95% full charge most times. You gel battery will lose about one year of service life over time but will do the job just fine until then.

If anybody wishes to see the facts and sources for this rant in print and does not care to do the minimal search and research themselves, merely Paypal the funds to me for a 2 hour session and I will send you an abstract.

Post by **Beemeridian** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 6:38 am

Post by **MikeCam** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 7:50 am

Dave,

That's a beautifully deflating and appropriate hoot!

geothepencil · Post by **geothepencil** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 10:50 am

A better use of the pulpit would be to instruct the BMW dealers who blasted the gels with industrial strength battery chargers on setup only to find that the gels were failing after a year or less. I wonder why. I hope they all figured it out eventually, but they ruined a lot of batteries before that IMO.

True the regular little Deltrans won't hurt the gels much, but there is a model for the gels as noted. Thats why I have two different chargers, even though I only have two gel batteries at the moment.

geo

Post by **boxermania** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 2:25 pm

At the expense of putting foot in mouth.....which I have been known to do quite often, I'm going to take a stab at the diference between the BMW brand charger and the Deltran.

The Deltran - Made by Deltran for Gel batteries

The BMW - First the key word here "advanced" what it means is that it has the BMW logo printed on it and therefore is more expensive...usually by 50% or so. After that, and in my humble oppinion, there is absolutely no diference between the Deltran and the BMW in their ability to charge a Gel battery.

I will challenge geothepencil by flashing $2 to take both of his appart, take pictures and post them for our review....better yet if he has electrical background he can explore the circuits. If anything is diferent it would be a higher voltage diode and the associated capacitor.....I rest my case.

Yes, I'm a misanthropist and it bothers the wee-wee out of me that people are continuously being taken advantage by smoke and mirrors.......

"Advanced battery charging system"....does that mean that is an upgrade from a prior one, or unique to the world of battery charges, or maybe made in other planet, or there are materials and elements inside that box not available to any other mortal on the face of the earth.....so; can we get a chunk of carbon and convert it to gold if hooked to that contraption.....yes, that would definitely fit the advanced tittle....as George Carlin would say.

geothepencil · Post by **geothepencil** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 2:37 pm

Wow, a paying job ! Well, I'll see what I can do about that. I think the difference is that the gel one charges at a slightly lower voltage, probably a couple of tenths of a volt less. Ill see if they come apart easily and will look around in there for component differences.

You know, I don't think Deltran makes the GEL specific charger anymore. Can't find it on their web site. They list the same one for gel, agm and lead acid. Now whether the charging routines are the same as my non gel model is unknown.

geo

darth_rockster · Post by **darth_rockster** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 3:32 pm

I have the battery tender that has a sticker saying programmed for gel batteries. I ordered it from the link below which says "perfect for bmw gel bats"

Not sure if this will help but I have some additional info.

I wrote deltran once asking which charger on batterytender.com is the same as the one the bmw dealer sells. Here's what they sent me.

From: support [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 9:34 AM
To: me
Subject: RE: Battery Tender Plus Question

The following is a message from the company president.

I will try to end the confusion about the new BMW Gel battery Battery Tender.

The BMW Gel Battery Tender is in fact different than the normal Battery Tender Plus. Although the Deltran Battery Tender Plus and the BMW Battery Tender appear the same they are quite different. Approximately one year ago BMW contacted us concerning their new Gel battery that is manufactured by Exide battery in Germany. We were instructed to redesign the charge algorithm to comply specifically with the new Exide Gel battery. Exide recommended very specific changes to the charge curve, one being a timed sequence during the absorption period. Please keep in mind that our engineering staff has been designing charge curves for over fourteen years and prior to this design request had never seen anything quite like the new Exide Gel.

As the old saying goes, Ã¢â‚¬Å“the customer always knows best,Ã¢â‚¬Â we can only do as requested. If BWM/Exide says charge it to their instructions and the battery will last through the warranty period who are we to argue. If it is any consolation, we have found it to be a very good battery and should give you many years of service.

We do claim per our packaging that we correctly charge gel batteries, prior to seeing the Exide battery that statement was true, we are now changing our packaging to indicate otherwise. Due to the new battery design, and to comply with the BMW warranty, the customer must purchase a Ã¢â‚¬Å“Gel SpecificÃ¢â‚¬Â battery charger.

After all these years in the charger business we are still amazed how every manufacture tryÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s to re-invent the battery. We realize that with all the different batteries in the market place the customer becomes very confused and is usually forced to spend more money. Approximately three years ago Harley-Davidson changed their battery design and manufacturer, it proved to be a very wise decision and we can only hope it works out best for BMW, and most importantly, you the customer.

Sorry for the Confusion,
Mike Prelec
President,
Deltran Corp.

Follow this link to the gel battery charger with our label.

http://www.batterymart.com/battery.mv?p=DEL-021-0156

Joe Harding
Deltran
801 U.S. Hwy. 92 East
Deland Fl. 32724
Phone: (386)736-7900

allanj255 · Post by **allanj255** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 5:42 pm

this is what I use in UK for my BMW gel battery on my R
http://www.accumate.co.uk/it010003.html
I leave it plugged in all year between rides and still have the original battery on the bike which is 4 and a half years old.

Post by **TicTac50** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 9:19 pm

http://www.acichagers.com
This is the charger that was suggested by an ODYSSEY BATTERIES sales person. I opted for the 1206CC Model. In the last 3 years I used the charger only once on my PC680 ODYSSEY BATTERY. I think that the best charger for the battery (acid or gel) is a good alternator. I am not sure that I will spend an extra $75.00 to prolong the life of $100.00 battery for one extra year. In theory: the gel charger Vs acid charger could charge battery differently, but in the reality, the voltage regulator on R1150R does not know what battery it is charging. Unless I see an alternator with built in voltage regulator specifically for GEL batteries, I will use my ACI charger made in China.

Arbee · Post by **Arbee** » Fri Nov 23, 2007 1:57 am

Perhaps instead of comparing battery chargers to one another we should
be comparing a battery charger to the BMW Bike alternator/regulator to
see what the differences are, as they are huge.

As for determining that a battery will last 12 months less based on a
different charger is merely supposition.

Battery failure due to charging is based on Heat buildup extremes not
current flow all batteries under charge should be supervised to avoid
excess heat, i would not personally walk away from a battery under
charge for very long.

Like the ocean you dont turn your back on it for very long either.

Post by **MartinW** » Fri Nov 23, 2007 5:12 am

Not sure that this is 'on-tpopc' but I too use an 'optimate' charger and my original battery (5 years 6 months) is still going strong. However, it is NOT a gel battery but a normal lead-acid type. Maybe BMW changed the spec to a gel battery sometime after 2002

Johan_SA · Post by **Johan_SA** » Fri Nov 23, 2007 5:37 am

Hi
May I approach this from a different angle as the battery in my 2002 is now getting old?

I frankly don't know if I have a gel or led-acid (sealed) battery in my bike. However, should I need to replace the battery and replace it with the type not currently in the bike - will the "regulator" know to increase or reduce the charging rate because I now have a different battery in?

Will I have to make any modifications to the charging system if I want to change to either gel or led-acid?

Thanks
Johan

Post by **boxermania** » Fri Nov 23, 2007 5:49 am

TicTac50 provided and excellent and different perspective to the argument.....what can I say.....