Multi-brand dealer vs. single brand dealer
Moderator: Moderators
Multi-brand dealer vs. single brand dealer
So, if you had your d'ruthers, would you take your bike to be serviced at a multi-brand dealer or to a dealer that specializes in on brand only? Does it make a difference?
arkline #27
not THE Ron Kline
"No matter where you go, there you are."
not THE Ron Kline
"No matter where you go, there you are."
-
dallara
Dealers...
Wow, Ron...
I'll bet you're gonna' crack a can of worms on that question!
Been a while since we have had a good ol' "Bash The Dealer" thread, and something tells me this is gonna' work itself inot one of those somewhere along the way...
But anyway... Personally, I don't care if he is multi-line or single-line, as long as he has competent, experienced, and courteous staff. My store (long ago in a galaxy far, far away...) was single-line, then multi-line, then single-line again after I discovered that Euro-Bikes just wouldn't fly in our market (and we don't have any Euro brands in our burg today... Only Jap and H-D). It was always my goal to have the best mechanics/service staff I could find and good, competent parts people.
The dealerships I like to do business with have one common thread... The same thing. Sharp service managers, experienced and knowledgable mechanics, well-trained parts people who know their products and inventory, and overall solid management...
One is the local Kawasaki/Yamaha dealer - who has all that and more - whereas our Honda/Suzuki dealer is run poorly, hires high-schooler's with no training or experience for mechanics, has a service manager who acts as if he doing you a favor if he even speaks to you, and parts staff that couldn't find their arse with a roadmap and video directions. It's even rare when you can get them to answer the phone in less than 20 rings... Maybe that's why down here the Kawa/Yammie store outsells the Honda/Suzuki store by a factor of 2-to-1.
The Harley store is worse... It is a beautiful facility owned by two lawyers, but they are truly absentee owners who are never there. They only have it as a diversion, and they hire true Harley-biker types who look severely down their noses at anyone who doesn't ride a "Hog", and they won't even talk to someone interested in a Buell... Maybe that's why there are less than a dozen Buell's in my town, and half of those came from dealers out of town, and the local dealer has two year old Buell's on his floor.
My favorite BMW store also sells Triumph's, and the entire staff there is super-friendly, happy to service out-of-town customers, seems to truly take an interest in their customers' well-being, and does fantastic, on-time, clean work... and at what I consider to be a fair price. When your bike is worked on there you meet the mechanic that will be working on your bike, and when the work is done the service writer brings it around and goes over every detail of the work and explains anything you have questions about until you are satisfied. You never feel rushed, and they seem to go out of their way to make you happy.
On the other hand, the Beemer dealer that is closer to me (the one above is nearly 200 miles away from me...) by 50 miles and is BMW-only has lackadaisical staff that have sort of a "whatever" attitude, the place is dirty, and half the time the parts man or service manager isn't even there... I know numerous people who have been promised their bike on a certain day and time only to get there and be told "We didn't get to it... Call us in another couple of days..." I know of others who have paid in advance to special order parts only to find out a few days later, when they were told the part would be there, that it hadn't even been ordered yet!
This is also the shop I originally tried to buy a new R-1150-R from, only they refused to order me a silver 2004 because they had three red 2004's and three Rockster's in stock... Then the salesperson actually blew up and yelled at me when I came in to buy parts and I informed her that I had bought a used one! I bought the parts (some oil filters, crush washers, and a couple of replacement clear lenses that were had gotten cracked), and I even went back a couple of other times to try and buy something, but each time was treated like I had leprosy because I didn't buy a bike from them...
Not so with the other Beemer shop I mentioned previously. They, instead, asked me where I had bought it, looked up service records on it, praised me for the price I bought it for, and told me that if I ever wanted a new one to please contact them... And then ask me along on one of their rides and poured me another cup of coffee!
Point of all this is simple... It's not the number of lines they carry but how they run their operation and what kind of staff they have that makes the difference to me.
Just my two ducats...
Cheers!
Dallara
I'll bet you're gonna' crack a can of worms on that question!
Been a while since we have had a good ol' "Bash The Dealer" thread, and something tells me this is gonna' work itself inot one of those somewhere along the way...
But anyway... Personally, I don't care if he is multi-line or single-line, as long as he has competent, experienced, and courteous staff. My store (long ago in a galaxy far, far away...) was single-line, then multi-line, then single-line again after I discovered that Euro-Bikes just wouldn't fly in our market (and we don't have any Euro brands in our burg today... Only Jap and H-D). It was always my goal to have the best mechanics/service staff I could find and good, competent parts people.
The dealerships I like to do business with have one common thread... The same thing. Sharp service managers, experienced and knowledgable mechanics, well-trained parts people who know their products and inventory, and overall solid management...
One is the local Kawasaki/Yamaha dealer - who has all that and more - whereas our Honda/Suzuki dealer is run poorly, hires high-schooler's with no training or experience for mechanics, has a service manager who acts as if he doing you a favor if he even speaks to you, and parts staff that couldn't find their arse with a roadmap and video directions. It's even rare when you can get them to answer the phone in less than 20 rings... Maybe that's why down here the Kawa/Yammie store outsells the Honda/Suzuki store by a factor of 2-to-1.
The Harley store is worse... It is a beautiful facility owned by two lawyers, but they are truly absentee owners who are never there. They only have it as a diversion, and they hire true Harley-biker types who look severely down their noses at anyone who doesn't ride a "Hog", and they won't even talk to someone interested in a Buell... Maybe that's why there are less than a dozen Buell's in my town, and half of those came from dealers out of town, and the local dealer has two year old Buell's on his floor.
My favorite BMW store also sells Triumph's, and the entire staff there is super-friendly, happy to service out-of-town customers, seems to truly take an interest in their customers' well-being, and does fantastic, on-time, clean work... and at what I consider to be a fair price. When your bike is worked on there you meet the mechanic that will be working on your bike, and when the work is done the service writer brings it around and goes over every detail of the work and explains anything you have questions about until you are satisfied. You never feel rushed, and they seem to go out of their way to make you happy.
On the other hand, the Beemer dealer that is closer to me (the one above is nearly 200 miles away from me...) by 50 miles and is BMW-only has lackadaisical staff that have sort of a "whatever" attitude, the place is dirty, and half the time the parts man or service manager isn't even there... I know numerous people who have been promised their bike on a certain day and time only to get there and be told "We didn't get to it... Call us in another couple of days..." I know of others who have paid in advance to special order parts only to find out a few days later, when they were told the part would be there, that it hadn't even been ordered yet!
This is also the shop I originally tried to buy a new R-1150-R from, only they refused to order me a silver 2004 because they had three red 2004's and three Rockster's in stock... Then the salesperson actually blew up and yelled at me when I came in to buy parts and I informed her that I had bought a used one! I bought the parts (some oil filters, crush washers, and a couple of replacement clear lenses that were had gotten cracked), and I even went back a couple of other times to try and buy something, but each time was treated like I had leprosy because I didn't buy a bike from them...
Not so with the other Beemer shop I mentioned previously. They, instead, asked me where I had bought it, looked up service records on it, praised me for the price I bought it for, and told me that if I ever wanted a new one to please contact them... And then ask me along on one of their rides and poured me another cup of coffee!
Point of all this is simple... It's not the number of lines they carry but how they run their operation and what kind of staff they have that makes the difference to me.
Just my two ducats...
Cheers!
Dallara
Well, 'round here there are a large number of multi-line bike mega-boo-tee-ques. And there are a fair number of single-line shops. And I can't for the life of me figure out whether or not the least of the lines in a multi-line shop would get short shrift when it came to service. I expect (perhaps incorrectly) that a shop servicing one brand would be more likely to be getting good at it since they would come to know the quirks of said brand...
But if you're only working on one Framazappa for every 20 MobileticaZoomers, wouldn't that have an effect on your ability to provide topnotch service for the Framazappas?
Say, just for kicks, I'm looking at Aprilias. And the only shop within 250 miles sells Guzzis, Laverdas (!), Aprilias, and a bunch of different scooters. They sell tons'o'scooters, a bunch of Guzzis, a few Aprilias, and a Laverda every two years or so. How would you assess their ability to keep the Aprilias factory fresh?
But if you're only working on one Framazappa for every 20 MobileticaZoomers, wouldn't that have an effect on your ability to provide topnotch service for the Framazappas?
Say, just for kicks, I'm looking at Aprilias. And the only shop within 250 miles sells Guzzis, Laverdas (!), Aprilias, and a bunch of different scooters. They sell tons'o'scooters, a bunch of Guzzis, a few Aprilias, and a Laverda every two years or so. How would you assess their ability to keep the Aprilias factory fresh?
arkline #27
not THE Ron Kline
"No matter where you go, there you are."
not THE Ron Kline
"No matter where you go, there you are."
-
dallara
Arkline...
Arkline...
Engines is engines, bolts is bolts, chassis hold the wheels on, fuel burns the same the world over, physics is physics, and we don't care how the hell they do it in California ...
(The California line is an old MX'er joke...)
I don't know of any really good mechanic that can't work on anything, made anywhere, and not do a good job - particularly if he is armed with a good manual and any possible special tools unique to a brand. Motorcycles aren't "rocket science" despite what the various manufacturers want you to believe about their products... Air flows, fuel flows, combustion happens, electrons flow (well, except sometimes when Joesph Lucas is involved...), etc. and all this had been happening for over a century. Not too much of it is really new. And motorcycles in many ways are more mired up in about the '50's than most other vehicles.
Don't believe me? Well, the telescopic fork still rules the roost despite its shortcomings, though we unit construction in cars (essentially a monocoque construction) motorcycling has eschewed that development, we still see carbs on bikes despite the fact it is nearly impossible to find one on a car these days, motorcycles make more power but they really haven't gotten much lighter in the past few decades, aerodynamics of motorcycles are primitive, etc.
Essentially even the most complex motorcycle on the market today is a pretty primitive device, so it doesn't take much to figure one out if you understand all the basic mechanical concepts.
Point is, a good mechanic is a good mechanic, whether he works on more Honda's than Aprilia's... Doesn't mean he can't do great work on an Aprilia, or a Vespa for that matter.
Just my two pieces of silver...
Cheers!
Dallara
Engines is engines, bolts is bolts, chassis hold the wheels on, fuel burns the same the world over, physics is physics, and we don't care how the hell they do it in California ...
(The California line is an old MX'er joke...)
I don't know of any really good mechanic that can't work on anything, made anywhere, and not do a good job - particularly if he is armed with a good manual and any possible special tools unique to a brand. Motorcycles aren't "rocket science" despite what the various manufacturers want you to believe about their products... Air flows, fuel flows, combustion happens, electrons flow (well, except sometimes when Joesph Lucas is involved...), etc. and all this had been happening for over a century. Not too much of it is really new. And motorcycles in many ways are more mired up in about the '50's than most other vehicles.
Don't believe me? Well, the telescopic fork still rules the roost despite its shortcomings, though we unit construction in cars (essentially a monocoque construction) motorcycling has eschewed that development, we still see carbs on bikes despite the fact it is nearly impossible to find one on a car these days, motorcycles make more power but they really haven't gotten much lighter in the past few decades, aerodynamics of motorcycles are primitive, etc.
Essentially even the most complex motorcycle on the market today is a pretty primitive device, so it doesn't take much to figure one out if you understand all the basic mechanical concepts.
Point is, a good mechanic is a good mechanic, whether he works on more Honda's than Aprilia's... Doesn't mean he can't do great work on an Aprilia, or a Vespa for that matter.
Just my two pieces of silver...
Cheers!
Dallara
Allan,
I've really got to take a look at your coin collection...pieces of silver, pfennig, ducats, and lord knows what else...
I imagine you've got a sock full of quatloos, too...
Well, if it is just normal service stuff, you're right. Any good mechanic should be able to get it done correctly. The problem is assertaining if the quality of the mechanic approaches good. Got any hints on how to figure that out? Not that I've been disappointed with my current dealer. But being mostly thumbs, I don't have the right kind of experience to tell if someone is good or not. I could tell you if a computer tech was full of silicon, easy...
I've really got to take a look at your coin collection...pieces of silver, pfennig, ducats, and lord knows what else...
I imagine you've got a sock full of quatloos, too...
Well, if it is just normal service stuff, you're right. Any good mechanic should be able to get it done correctly. The problem is assertaining if the quality of the mechanic approaches good. Got any hints on how to figure that out? Not that I've been disappointed with my current dealer. But being mostly thumbs, I don't have the right kind of experience to tell if someone is good or not. I could tell you if a computer tech was full of silicon, easy...
arkline #27
not THE Ron Kline
"No matter where you go, there you are."
not THE Ron Kline
"No matter where you go, there you are."
Here in Grimsby, there are three bike dealers. One selling Japanese and Italian bikes (Aprilia, Honda and Suzuki), one selling just Japanese (Kawasaki) though he sells Peugeot scooters as well, and BMW who sell bikes and cars too, under the same roof.
The bike dealers are OK. The first one has the older, better and more experienced mechanics and is actually very good. The second is OK-ish.
But it's the BMW garage that fascinates me.
In the car side, the salesmen are very up their own arseholes. But sign on the dotted line and they become fawning and obsequious. Walk into the bike side, and it's a different world. You get a coffee and a chat, everyone's happy and enthusiastic.
When I collected my R in July, being a new biker, the handover took almost an hour. The salesman wanted to see me walk the machine around, gave me tips on all sorts of relevant issues and rode out with me for twenty minutes. This was on a second hand bike. I was well looked after.
The bike mechanic (for there is only one at this dealership) is brilliant. Knows his product inside out. When my R headlight cracked (stonechip) rather than let me buy a new one, he let me have the whole headlight assembly off a totalled R that was out the back for no charge.
Dallara has it about right. It's down to the individual dealership and the ethos that pervades the building.
J
The bike dealers are OK. The first one has the older, better and more experienced mechanics and is actually very good. The second is OK-ish.
But it's the BMW garage that fascinates me.
In the car side, the salesmen are very up their own arseholes. But sign on the dotted line and they become fawning and obsequious. Walk into the bike side, and it's a different world. You get a coffee and a chat, everyone's happy and enthusiastic.
When I collected my R in July, being a new biker, the handover took almost an hour. The salesman wanted to see me walk the machine around, gave me tips on all sorts of relevant issues and rode out with me for twenty minutes. This was on a second hand bike. I was well looked after.
The bike mechanic (for there is only one at this dealership) is brilliant. Knows his product inside out. When my R headlight cracked (stonechip) rather than let me buy a new one, he let me have the whole headlight assembly off a totalled R that was out the back for no charge.
Dallara has it about right. It's down to the individual dealership and the ethos that pervades the building.
J
BMW R850R in silver
heated grips
panniers
flyscreen
cylinder head protectors
heated grips
panniers
flyscreen
cylinder head protectors
-
dallara
Jonothan's got it...
Jonothan's got it...
Exactly the word I wished I could have remembered to use... Ethos. That says it exactly.
Arkline, it is all about that pervasiveness of attittude you feel in the right shops, and it's one of those things you just *know* when you are in the right ones. It can't be faked... And it runs from the front to the back, and vice versa. If the staff in the front of the shop as helpful, enthusiastic, knowledgable, etc. then there is a good chance the mechanics, etc. are of the same attitude. Good shops attract the best help, and good shops make you feel comfortable right away.
You asked for any hints on how you might know they are really good?
Well, forget trying to ask technical questions... You really probably wouldn't do that if you were meeting up with a computer tech to see if he fit your bill. No... You would simply talk with him... See how he carried himself. Does he exude a quiet confidence? Does he look you in the eye when he talks to you? Does he speak clearly and concisely, with no humming or hawing? He may not be extroverted, but does he appear to really like what he's doing? Do his tools look well cared for? He may not be dressed the best, or even have the best personal appearance, but is it obvious he cares for his own equipment (like his car or his motorcycle)?
Does he like to ride?
You know the drill...
Cheers!
Dallara
Exactly the word I wished I could have remembered to use... Ethos. That says it exactly.
Arkline, it is all about that pervasiveness of attittude you feel in the right shops, and it's one of those things you just *know* when you are in the right ones. It can't be faked... And it runs from the front to the back, and vice versa. If the staff in the front of the shop as helpful, enthusiastic, knowledgable, etc. then there is a good chance the mechanics, etc. are of the same attitude. Good shops attract the best help, and good shops make you feel comfortable right away.
You asked for any hints on how you might know they are really good?
Well, forget trying to ask technical questions... You really probably wouldn't do that if you were meeting up with a computer tech to see if he fit your bill. No... You would simply talk with him... See how he carried himself. Does he exude a quiet confidence? Does he look you in the eye when he talks to you? Does he speak clearly and concisely, with no humming or hawing? He may not be extroverted, but does he appear to really like what he's doing? Do his tools look well cared for? He may not be dressed the best, or even have the best personal appearance, but is it obvious he cares for his own equipment (like his car or his motorcycle)?
Does he like to ride?
You know the drill...
Cheers!
Dallara
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Simon D
Service
Johnathon, cherish that dealer! Service like that is soooooo rare in our field I'd forgotten it ever existed 
Take a tip from me, pop round and see them regularly, share a coffee with them and every now and again take in some doughnuts or cakes.
Don't even consider changing brands you'll only be dissappointed.
Take it easy. Simon
Take a tip from me, pop round and see them regularly, share a coffee with them and every now and again take in some doughnuts or cakes.
Don't even consider changing brands you'll only be dissappointed.
Take it easy. Simon